erover82
Well-known member
Seems to be something the generic auto journalists say while the 4x4 journalists have more realistic expectations.
Grenadier
- Thread starter WreckITFrank
- Start date
Seems to be something the generic auto journalists say while the 4x4 journalists have more realistic expectations.
WeBeCinYa
Well-known member
All the while this will be driven on the road, 90% of the time best case, right?
erover82
Well-known member
Yes, but aren't most utilitarian vehicles? Engineering compromises have to be made in order to excel in other aspects. I don't hear them complaining about low tow and payload ratings of a Prius or Civic.
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I test drove it and it wasn’t a big deal. Closer to my 110 than a new car, but not a deal breaker for me.
defenderholty
Well-known member
defenderholty
Well-known member
Agreed, and you have to consider that a 4x4 journalist would be far more loyal to the LR brand and apt to trash talk a Granadier
And we all know how poorly RRC’s and D1’s handle on the road…
WreckITFrank
Technical Excellence Contributor
I drove what i think was the first time recirculating ball, other than maybe some old military vehicles in my former years. The truth is that is does not return to center (without you putting it there), but I didnt find it to be much of a problem on my test drive. i relate it to a defender when going over a bump or small hill maybe while turning, it can get a bit squirrely if you are not paying attention but i did not feel in danger. And that was only 30 minutes of driving it... def not a vehicle to check your insta while driving....
I read on the forums that a claim was made to an update or one possible coming to further dial in. Also, some folks overseas seem to be engaging suspension vendors for an RTC type steering stab, that assists more back to center. Do the Jeep guys here feel any difference in their Wrangler to any other vehicle? From what I read the are all Recirc ball steering.
I read on the forums that a claim was made to an update or one possible coming to further dial in. Also, some folks overseas seem to be engaging suspension vendors for an RTC type steering stab, that assists more back to center. Do the Jeep guys here feel any difference in their Wrangler to any other vehicle? From what I read the are all Recirc ball steering.
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vtlandrover
Well-known member
Off-topic, but certainly related... after 30 blissful months, I sold my '22 Defender 110 in favor of a Rivian R1S. It's been three days and I may well have made a costly mistake. Don't get me wrong - the Rivian is incredible in many regards. However, there is ZERO comparison for road feel (to include steering), suspension (to include comfort), and composure (to include 'spacing out' behind the wheel) of the '22 110. I have to be 'on' in the Rivian all of the time. I have to pay attention to steering and throttle input with absolute attention. And I am, at times, uncomfortable going over road deformities. I never felt that way in the '22 Defender. It was composed, comfortable, capable, and in 30,000 miles, utterly faultless.
I guess my point is: don't believe a word that journalists or even your trusted nas-row buddy, Frank (me!), have to say. Drive whatever vehicle for yourself and decide whether it's right for you and your application. I rescinded my deposit and placement on the Grenadier and never had a chance to see it in person or drive it beforehand... that's not to say that I'll never drive or even own one. Just not now and likely not for a while. I wish Ineos success and wish I had the means to have them all... there's certainly a place for it in my garage.
I am going to give the Rivian its fair attention and have no intention of trading or backing away from it. I guess I've just got to admit that I don't have Sir Jim's pockets, but share his demand for a vehicle that does everything I want. After owning 75+ cars, that was the 2022 Defender 110.
P.S. What does the Rivian do well? For starters, it'll be in the teens tonight and when I get in the shower tomorrow morning, I'll set the climate to 74 degrees, turn on the seat and steering wheel heaters, and not asphyxiate myself or my family as it comes up to temperature in the garage; when a shitty-ass (but cool!) GTI rode my ass this morning out of frustration because I only drive 10-15% over the speed limit, I smoked him at the stop light (the Rivian does 0-60 in 3 seconds; the GTI in 8 (I felt a little nausea afterward, as I've never ridden a rollercoaster or smashed the throttle on a Rivian)); the back sleeps my 6' 1" frame with a foot to spare, with the vehicle perfectly level in"camp mode" and the aforementioned climate control set at 74, whether it's hot or cold outside; it has so many places to put stuff (including the 'frunk), it's absurd; and for sure, it's got tech galore... plus, almost zero maintenance. No leaks, no oil changes. I have enough ICEs (an '86 110; an '82.5 Westfalia; and an '01 A4 2.8) that I can get my knuckles bloody on... and to me, it's fine looking.
Happy Thanksgiving, nas-row pals!
I guess my point is: don't believe a word that journalists or even your trusted nas-row buddy, Frank (me!), have to say. Drive whatever vehicle for yourself and decide whether it's right for you and your application. I rescinded my deposit and placement on the Grenadier and never had a chance to see it in person or drive it beforehand... that's not to say that I'll never drive or even own one. Just not now and likely not for a while. I wish Ineos success and wish I had the means to have them all... there's certainly a place for it in my garage.
I am going to give the Rivian its fair attention and have no intention of trading or backing away from it. I guess I've just got to admit that I don't have Sir Jim's pockets, but share his demand for a vehicle that does everything I want. After owning 75+ cars, that was the 2022 Defender 110.
P.S. What does the Rivian do well? For starters, it'll be in the teens tonight and when I get in the shower tomorrow morning, I'll set the climate to 74 degrees, turn on the seat and steering wheel heaters, and not asphyxiate myself or my family as it comes up to temperature in the garage; when a shitty-ass (but cool!) GTI rode my ass this morning out of frustration because I only drive 10-15% over the speed limit, I smoked him at the stop light (the Rivian does 0-60 in 3 seconds; the GTI in 8 (I felt a little nausea afterward, as I've never ridden a rollercoaster or smashed the throttle on a Rivian)); the back sleeps my 6' 1" frame with a foot to spare, with the vehicle perfectly level in"camp mode" and the aforementioned climate control set at 74, whether it's hot or cold outside; it has so many places to put stuff (including the 'frunk), it's absurd; and for sure, it's got tech galore... plus, almost zero maintenance. No leaks, no oil changes. I have enough ICEs (an '86 110; an '82.5 Westfalia; and an '01 A4 2.8) that I can get my knuckles bloody on... and to me, it's fine looking.
Happy Thanksgiving, nas-row pals!
How does it feel compared to the old Mercedes steering setup?
You forgot to mention the most important part. You won’t have to be seen driving a new Defender.
You mention no leaks. I’m no expert on EVs, but don’t they still have normal cooling systems? The Jaguar I Pace does and it’s just as convoluted as any other JLR product (also just as leaky).
evilfij
Well-known member
Me at @WreckITFrank met up at main line overland open house and I got to see the grenadier.
A few observations. First, they have a very clever A pillar. Is deep but at an angle so it does not obstruct vision. It looks like a narrow a pillar when you are looking out. Well done. Second, the doors are very thick. I am sure it is side impact protection but it threw me off. Third, the interior fit and finish is Mitsubishi mirage level in some parts. Ok the seats are really nice, but stuff like the cargo area trim is laughable how chinsey it looks. Honestly, it would be better without any trim and just a rubber mat. I would be interested to see one stripped out and whether the trim can be deleted. Some rubber mats or coco mats or something would be better IMHO. Finally, the engine bay is interesting. It has a tub like look with a seal around it. Not sure if matter, but it struck me as different.
I had my LX600 there which is a bit more money, and I have my beloved GX460 (which is much less money), in comparison, the grenadier is more offroad focused, but it has the upright seating, stadium rear seating, vibe. A defender (the classic model) it is not, but it’s sort of close. It reminded me most of a wrangler (but with thick doors and better seats).
I don’t know what I am adding value wise, but it’s a long thread and I had not heard mention of my observations.
A few observations. First, they have a very clever A pillar. Is deep but at an angle so it does not obstruct vision. It looks like a narrow a pillar when you are looking out. Well done. Second, the doors are very thick. I am sure it is side impact protection but it threw me off. Third, the interior fit and finish is Mitsubishi mirage level in some parts. Ok the seats are really nice, but stuff like the cargo area trim is laughable how chinsey it looks. Honestly, it would be better without any trim and just a rubber mat. I would be interested to see one stripped out and whether the trim can be deleted. Some rubber mats or coco mats or something would be better IMHO. Finally, the engine bay is interesting. It has a tub like look with a seal around it. Not sure if matter, but it struck me as different.
I had my LX600 there which is a bit more money, and I have my beloved GX460 (which is much less money), in comparison, the grenadier is more offroad focused, but it has the upright seating, stadium rear seating, vibe. A defender (the classic model) it is not, but it’s sort of close. It reminded me most of a wrangler (but with thick doors and better seats).
I don’t know what I am adding value wise, but it’s a long thread and I had not heard mention of my observations.
Z.G
Well-known member
I heard this same complaint from a friend who drove it. Certainly not a journalist, but someone who's driven probably 300+ unique vehicles in their life
To add to that, this was a retail-ready production unit a couple of weeks ago.
Not to question driving style, but did he just pull out in front of someone, one finger on the wheel and punch it? Makes no sense compared to the prototype I drove in MD.
?????
EDIT: I’ll add that my wife doesn’t like driving the RRC LWB due to the heavy steering. Driving the Grenadier felt like our ‘96 D1, remarkably like a D1. I felt so at home I asked for a little 360 turnaround off the course (we were the last vehicle in line), my co-driver said go for it. So I putted around in the loaner D1.
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