This Noise

Roverman2010

Well-known member
Need to ask where this piston slap came from? Only time I have heard it was under heavy acceleration? If you asume that, I think on a 300 hundie if you drop the sump you should be able to see any scoring of the cylinder walls.

But what I hear from your vids is a rotary noise tapping somting ? Not sure if you are auto or stick? Have you checked the damper bolt is tight.

If you are due an oil change stick some Castrol GTX in it. Good luck on your Quest.
 

RBBailey

NAS-ROW Addict
Callsign: KF7KFZ
Here is a description of my frustration with this...

As I mentioned earlier, I stayed up late last week to very carefully learn how to really do a good job at setting the valves just right. I've only done valves on the 2.25 and the Defender once before, and I never did feel like I knew what it meant to be "just right" on 0.008. I worked out a way to get it somewhere close, but more importantly, to have really consistent results across all 8 valves.

That night, I ran it for a few minutes just to make sure it didn't sound bad. All good.
The next day I ran it up and down the street a bit, and noted that it sure sounded -- GOOD. And even the odd knock that I've been dealing with seemed diminished.
I drove it on a short errand, all good.
I started it up, and drove it on the freeway, and just far enough to get the temps up past 180 degrees. It ran super smooth and quiet, and my brother and I were able to have a conversation, and we noted that it really felt good. I started making plans! More modifications for overlanding, trips for the summer!

....Yesterday and today, I drive it and it is all rough and loud and knocky.... Totally different experience.

I do think I have diminished the ringing knock sound by having the pump set just right, and the first two valves looser than they were. But I just can't understand the drastic difference in driving experience I'm having from one drive to the next.
 

RBBailey

NAS-ROW Addict
Callsign: KF7KFZ
I've had Ship's here in Portland drive the truck for several days, I got the oil analyzed, and everyone from from my wife to the guy from Land Rover Toolbox Videos, who actually commented on my video, says there seems to be no problem, just drive it.

I hear the pinging, but I'm trying to ignore it. And I hear the loudness in idle and when on hills, etc... But I'm trying to ignore it.

Then yesterday I drove a farm-truck of a 200Tdi, and the idle was actually smooth and diesel-purrness, and the whole experience of the noise from low to high RPMs was totally different than what I get. I also did get it up to 70, but that is topping 3k RPM, and it really doesn't seem happy to be there.
 

RBBailey

NAS-ROW Addict
Callsign: KF7KFZ
OK, the knock/ping has developed enough that I'm pretty sure I can tell where it is coming from. It has always been from the front of the engine, so I've periodically prodded around with a stethoscope to see if I could get a good focus point. In the past, I've thought that I could tell that it was coming from near the water pump, maybe even the #1 piston. The noise is just different enough with the stethoscope that it blends away, and is difficult to detect.

However, I'm almost certain now that I can detect this noise 100% from upper front cover. 90% sure it is coming from the region between the water pump and the tensioner pulley. And I can hear it off the front of the block, but not anywhere past the first piston.

I'm unsure how to proceed. I could pull the front cover, but there seems to be a strong possibility that it is coming from that upper water pump region that is not under the front cover. And although there are a lot of spinning parts in this area, I can't imagine what it is I'm even looking for.

What is involved in pulling the front cover? What tools will I need? Will I need to buy new seals? I ask only to try to head off the surprises that always catch me off guard when I start a "simple" project.
 

RBBailey

NAS-ROW Addict
Callsign: KF7KFZ
OK, so I should count on 6 hours of wrenching time, spread out across 3 days! LOL!



...no, but really.
 

RBBailey

NAS-ROW Addict
Callsign: KF7KFZ
I took another few minutes to listen before putting it away this evening in order to really be sure about where I might want to start unbolting things:

  1. It is loudest at the thermostat housing. By far.
  2. Next loudest at the water pump area.
  3. Third loudest in the area around the tensioner pulley.
  4. It can still be heard along the block and head near piston #1, but much more faintly.
Oddly, none of these first three spots are actually directly connected, but they are all bolted to the front of the engine in roughly the same area. So maybe this is all coming from a piston slap in #1 that can only be heard at idle?
 

Red90

Well-known member
Take off the drive belt and run it briefly. If the noise goes away then you know it is something being driven fro the belt. If it stays, then it is in the engine.
 

RBBailey

NAS-ROW Addict
Callsign: KF7KFZ
Since there is a lot of the noise coming from the thermostat, I took a long shot and opened it up and pulled the thermostat out, refilled with as much coolant as I could, then ran it to see if just by chance the thermostat itself has somehow loose and flapping against the housing.

No dice. Same sound.

If I get the chance, I'll try my luck at pulling the cover to see if I can find anything, but I'm leaning more and more to a serious engine issue at #1 piston. (Underneath the knock, the engine purrs like a kitten, and the knock goes away at around 1500 rpm.)
 

Napalm00

Technical Excellence Contributor
If your engines been running this long there's no serious engine issue.

Do valve adjustment ,check the injectors, reduce the timing, replace all the belts, check your handbrake
 

RBBailey

NAS-ROW Addict
Callsign: KF7KFZ
How old are your injectors ?


Injectors were bought from Davis 7000 miles ago. Timing was done by Ship's Mechanical 7500 miles ago. I have adjusted the valves a few times since then. Once to just make sure, once to experiment with loose valves, and once to really nail it down. I think they are OK.

Based on my testing today, I'm 100% sure it is coming from either the main pulley on the timing belt under the cover (cam shaft gear), or the #1 piston. I can hear it clearly in both spots without the serp belt in place. So it can't be coming from the water pump, or any of the other ancillary front pulleys. When listening to the block or head, it comes across as a tick. When listening to the timing cover it comes across more like a knock. When you hear it out in the open, it sounds like a knocking ringing sound.
 

RBBailey

NAS-ROW Addict
Callsign: KF7KFZ
I will be pulling the pan first. Now that I’ve shut down as many moving parts as possible, the noise is easier to hear from the block and water pump side than from the front cover. I’m betting I find a worn out bearing or bad piston. I need to change the oil anyway....
 

RBBailey

NAS-ROW Addict
Callsign: KF7KFZ
That's new terminology for me.

What should I look for when I pull the pan? I'm hoping to be able to look up into #1, and to see the bearings down low. I'll also see if I can test compression, and get a camera into the top of piston #1.
 

RBBailey

NAS-ROW Addict
Callsign: KF7KFZ
I was just about to proceed with a compression test. But I realized that I was thinking of using the glow plug ports....? but the manual says to use the injector ports.

Process in my head was:

  1. Remove all glow plugs
  2. Connect test kit to one plug port
  3. Crank 10-20 seconds (disconnected fuel solenoid)
  4. Note pressure, then release
  5. Move to next cylinder
Am I OK?
 
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