Engine/transmission Survey

[madscientist]

If you were to build a Defender 110 and use it as they were intended to be used. Off road vehicle, grocery getter, farm tractor and you had a choice of:
Cummins R2.8 8 speed auto , 5 or 6 speed manual
Gen5 LT1 6.2 V8 8 speed auto only
Which would you choose
Oliver

 

[NPT90]

depends on budget.

I've looked at this pretty extensively for when my 300TDI passes on to the other side and I hate to say it but I think I would be looking at a TDCI/puma bulkhead as a pretty good option.

Only for the plug and play ease and parts availability via UK suppliers.

If those where the only 2 options the cummins is a no-brainer. LS is awesome power but aside from cheap replacement bits the fabrication and adapters to shoehorn the engine in there seem like a lot more work than a cummins (especially once the kits with mounts ect become ubiquitous)

 

[madscientist]

Disregard budget, just go with your gut.

LS or LT are no more difficult to install than the Cummins

 

[Napalm00]

As intended? 200tdi , short r380

 

[javelinadave]

I do appreciate the Cummins and the LS conversions butI'm a purist so it would have to be a LR motor. 300Tdi or Td5 with an R380.
What is the @madscientist cooking up next?

 

[madscientist]

I just want to know if given a choice between LT or Cummins, Manual our Auto what most real Defender owners would want. LS3 have been done to death in Defenders and the LT is much better in my opinion when backed by 8 speed auto. But it's more Gucci Rover.
200 and 300 TDI were okay back in the day but they are pretty gutless in the mountains west, no altitude compensation and tweaking more power out of them is not cost effective to me.

 

[SARTech]

A choice between the two. A cummins with a manual transmission.

 

[WreckITFrank]

not sure if I qualify yet as a "real defender owner" but when i build out a 110 for my wife and I to travel the US (at some point) it will be with a 2.8 cummins and whatever auto trans is the best option at the time. I am all about manual, but I think would not be as suitable for long term travel while switching up drivers. new 2.8 price makes it much more shiny than before.

all about the power, reliability, and mileage of a *new diesel.

 

[Uncle Douglas]

It strikes me as funny you are asking this given your builds Oliver.
My vote is the Cummins with a manual trans. Pulls the Eastern range grade to the Eisenhower in 5th like it's child's play. With the Cummins you don't need to use that " nearest fuel station" app on your phone.

 

[madscientist]

My builds are Gucci Rovers. Seems the trend of the last few years has been big V8 automatic Defenders with everything wrapped in leather and zero driver interaction with the vehicle on the way to Starbucks. If I could make it self drive even better.
Just wanted to see if any one out there would still want a good Diesel and likes to change gears.
Have to admit the LT1 I just did in a Defender 90 with 8 speed auto makes me giggle when I drive.

 

[DefendersNW]

Neither...

300tdi for mainly back country and remote use
Td5 for mainly on-road and front country use

 

[Z.G]

Between the two you listed, the 2.8. I'd probably go with that if it were more economical, but I love the 300.

 

[rocky]

In many ways the 90 with the 200tdi I drove years ago was everything I needed. We're all suckers for power and it would be interesting to try the Cummins. There is a lot to be said for having a Powertrain that is still in production.

 

[13diamonds]

I'm a little biased so I say the Cummins R2.8 and manual is the way to go. More than enough torque no matter where I take it and easy enough swap with all the adapters and transmission choices.

 

[abraded]

I am a diesel fan and the Cummins is enticing. But, one of the things that makes a Defender cool is that it ages so well. Theoretically you're building something that you (or someone else) is going to be happy about owning in 10, 20, ... years. The Cummins is one of the hot transplant powerplants right now. Cummins say the are going to support it in the future. But they have been known to drop domestic support of powerplants before. When sensors fail in 10 years are there going to be parts? Will anyone at Cummins be interested in helping diagnose faults in that time frame. For a rig in the US, the widespread use of the LS variants guarantees future availability.

So, it kind of seems that for a long term vehicle you may be better going with an LS or perhaps living with the lack of power of a 300tdi (but the definite upside of fairly widespread parts support of the usual Rover suppliers).

 

[RBBailey]

I'm running the R380 and 300Tdi. It feels very Land Rover-ish. It is almost too slow, almost too loud, almost not enough power, but somehow still manages to be operational. I have been over the mountains here several times in both mild and in hot weather. If I don't have idiot drivers in front of me, I can do the passes at 4500 feet or so without going below 50mph. Hills above a certain length or steepness just slow it down, no matter what altitude I'm at. If I go above 5000 feet (I've been as high as 6500 in 80 degrees ambient temps) I start to notice how gutless it feels even on flat. I would like to drive a D90 with the same set up someday to see what the difference is like.

That last point about the vehicle aging well is probably a good one. I have a '65 Series IIa that is almost completely original, and when I compare it to the Defender, I have to admit that the Defender is becoming a classic vehicle in the same way that the Series is. In the next 10-20 years, I don't want to be dealing with parts issues for an engine that is any more obscure than the 300Tdi. If it fails, I will probably rebuild it, or get something like an LS replacement. I might look into the Td5, but only if there are enough of them around at that time to justify the change.

 

[RDavisinVA]

Chevy 292 inline 6, heavy duty R380 Stumpy with High speed 5th gear. 1.22 transfercase.
GM HEI with Holley Sniper.
Powerful, cheap, reliable, very very very low maintenance.

 

[jimbobwae]

1. It has to be manual to express the essence of driving
2. It needs to cruise highways to wild places with pace and confidence
3. Needs reliable power off road to rumble into and out of places that are befitting of exploration in solo mode if desired
Whatever specs enable the most desirable experience

 

[MountainD]

I know this threads been dead for a bit, but in DENVER/Boulder, you still can’t register the R2.8 as it doesn’t qualify here in CO for emissions areas. And I hear the other areas in CO is just a matter of time. I’ve done an LS, but fallen in love with diesels too and really want to do one. Davis’s292 swap is also a no-go as no 292’s are made after my 1991 110 (engine also has to be newer than vehicle). No 4BT’s are allowed (they have never done in light weight vehicle, believe it or not) and computer modifications for M57 or OM606 are harder right now (have to use it for swap as well as all emissions equip). Just getting hard. Honestly, I’ve looked at so many options, I think the best bet is (in my case) is the original 200tdi, tuned up super well until (AND DONT SHOOT ME!) that an electric motor and (more important) the batteries become more available, efficient and better. They are not that far off. https://www.thedrive.com/tech/30431/electric-v-8-crate-motor-from-electric-gt-is-sema-swap-ready
I think if I’m going through another swap... but no, the battery/range/efficiency/charging network is not where it needs to be.

 

[lcdck]

I’m with you on this. Down the road I hope to convert to electric or be driving an electric truck with long range. Many may feel differently but I think it will continue to gain popularity and prices will cost will continue to go down as technology advances and more demand creates more suppliers. https://about.bnef.com/blog/battery...ps-up-with-market-average-at-156-kwh-in-2019/

this has no bearing on the original question.