Clutch Fluid

RBBailey

NAS-ROW Addict
Callsign: KF7KFZ
Yesterday, the pedal started squeaking with a quick creak when I put the clutch in. I can't tell if it might just be the pedal itself, or the cylinder. Just can't nail down the source.

But I opened up the cap to the reservoir and looked around for leaks and noticed that the fluid is pretty dark. There are about 12k miles on this clutch, almost all parts are new.

The clutch has always felt a bit stiff to me, but I've got nothing to compare it to in order to know what that even means. Others have driven it. One guy initially said, "Oh, your clutch feels... well... never mind, seems fine." But that's about it.

So should I.... Could I.... What might I do?
 

jymmiejamz

Founding Member
Callsign: KN4JHI
My 300 Tdi 110 had an LT77 and the clutch was super stiff. My leg would feel like jello if I got stuck in city traffic.
 

ghoregon

Active member
My pedal has done the same, lubed up the pivot point and all was right again. I also have a very heavy clutch pedal, I think due to the HD clutch I installed. You mention the fluid is dark, check this out if you haven't already...super nice upgrade.

 

RBBailey

NAS-ROW Addict
Callsign: KF7KFZ
I'm thinking of siphoning out the fluid, replacing with new, then watching to see how long it takes to cloud up again. That SDO kit may be in my near future.
 

red64chevelle

Active member
This is on my project list. LOF has on their website:
1. Does the POWERspring fit my DEFENDER?
The LOF POWERspring will fit Defender models 300TDI, TD5 and also TDCI PUMA vehicles.
In order to double check that it will fit, simply take a look at your clutch pedal:
  • If the clutch pedal arm is a flat sheet of steel in terms of profile – IT FITS!
  • If the clutch pedal arm is a U shaped formed steel profile, unfortunately it wont fit, but there is a solution! Simply remove the older 200TDI style pedal box (6 bolts in the footwell) and refit with the later style pedal box – Part number SKB500280 (sold separately)
So I would need https://www.lrdirect.com/SKB500280-Pedal-Clutch/ and https://lofclutches.com/shop/td5/l-o-f-powerspring-pedal-assister-kit/?v=7516fd43adaa
 

Roverman2010

Well-known member
Not sure what this powerspring thingy is, but fit a TD5 clutch unit I found it a big improvement. I was going to go with a Red Booster as I have a dodgy left leg but the newer unit is great.
 

red64chevelle

Active member
Not sure what this powerspring thingy is, but fit a TD5 clutch unit I found it a big improvement. I was going to go with a Red Booster as I have a dodgy left leg but the newer unit is great.

From what I gather, the powerspring sold by LOF is a stronger spring than what comes on the TD5 clutch pedal. So it reduces the pedal effort even further.
 

JimC

Super Moderator
Staff member
I think it’s the exact opposite, it’s a weaker spring thereby reducing effort. The LOF one only has two winds, stock has three. Seems like the spring would resist the push and spring the pedal back to the up position. I’ve been trying to think my way through this one.
 

Red90

Well-known member
I think it’s the exact opposite, it’s a weaker spring thereby reducing effort. The LOF one only has two winds, stock has three. Seems like the spring would resist the push and spring the pedal back to the up position. I’ve been trying to think my way through this one.

No stronger. The newer style clutch boxes use an over center spring. It pushes down in the down position and up in the up position.

Personally, I've tried the change and found it did not do a lot other than make the clutch feel less linear. I have not tried this heavier spring though. I see they want insane shipping money.

The other problem with the new clutch pedal boxes is that they eliminated the adjustable up stop and rely of the master rod to hold the pedal height in tension. It is a bad design, IMO. I added an up stop to my pedal box.
 

RBBailey

NAS-ROW Addict
Callsign: KF7KFZ
Have not driven the truck in almost three weeks. Started it and checked things out today. Now... I've been driving a new BMW and Jeep for the past two weeks in Europe, so when I hit the clutch in my truck, I'm not sure if I'm just not in shape anymore, or..... But it feels really stiff. Also like the first inch is just nothing, then it gets progressively harder from there. Thoughts?
 

Napalm00

Technical Excellence Contributor
Dark fluid is sadly normal due to the aluminum bore master. The dorman cast iron conversion is worthwhile. There certainly isn't any harm in bleeding out the old fluid

Clutch stiffness , if everything else is in good shape , is dictated by the pressure plate on the clutch you have .

I had a six spring aftermarket 130 hd clutch in my truck years ago and it would destroy my left quad muscle in heavy traffic... Especially after leg day at the gym . I swapped it out when doing the t seals to a valeo branded 130 six spring clutch and it's so so much better !

Next clutch will probably be a lof ceramic with the td5 pedal box, whenever I finish my spare engine.
 

Napalm00

Technical Excellence Contributor
As for nothing for the first inch, I would check the adjustment on the pedal box.
Agreed here as well. The service manual has the measurement for the clutch pedal adjustment and distance to the floor. It's really easy to do.

And not to freak you out but another symptom of a super ultrastiff clutch that has like a grinding feeling is the clutch fork about the bust through its pivot point. If you're sneaky and you have a borescope or an inspection mirror you may be able to see it by removing the clutch slave and looking through the hole
 

RBBailey

NAS-ROW Addict
Callsign: KF7KFZ
Interesting.

I'm going to keep driving to evaluate. I made the mistake of driving with flip flops yesterday, which was different than I usually do, so the feeling was all off anyway!
 

jymmiejamz

Founding Member
Callsign: KN4JHI
And not to freak you out but another symptom of a super ultrastiff clutch that has like a grinding feeling is the clutch fork about the bust through its pivot point. If you're sneaky and you have a borescope or an inspection mirror you may be able to see it by removing the clutch slave and looking through the hole

Mine had a reinforced clutch fork when the throwout bearing failed. I replaced that and the clutch, and it was still just as stiff when I was done. I didn't use a heavy duty unit.
 

NPT90

Well-known member
Mine had a reinforced clutch fork when the throwout bearing failed. I replaced that and the clutch, and it was still just as stiff when I was done. I didn't use a heavy duty unit.

BritRest HD clutch fork was the best design I found. The teflon ball instead of metal on metal made a huge difference (I think). But I will say most folks who describe a difficult clutch that seems to be degrading have the clutch fork failure looming. In my case I also replaced the slave cylinder and that helped immensely.
 
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